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Post by kooch on Feb 16, 2019 8:13:01 GMT -6
I just watched my wife take a soft rubber spatula and scrape the last bit of peanut butter out of a jar and scrape it off into the newly opened jar. Then, I watched her wash used zip lock bags for reuse.
I'm 100% sure that if we run out of money in retirement it'll be my fault, not hers.
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Post by sd51555 on Feb 16, 2019 8:23:10 GMT -6
Hell, I'm outright afraid of bonds. Take all this with a grain of salt and talk with a professional, but I could never make the idea pan out. When Obamacare became law, I bet against the economy and fed and lost my ass. What I thought would happen happened, but I missed one big thing. I thought it would be very bad for the economy for ten million people to lose their full time jobs and get knocked down to part time. I was right about that.
What I missed was that the Obama slump unleashed the greatest period in stock buyback history. That defensive move set the stage for the rally when trump was elected. Companies had no reason to invest in growth because there was none to be had. Insurance was eating away at consumption dollars, and outlooks were terrible. So you pull the artificial maneuver of driving down your share count, thus driving up your stock price. Once growth returned, those stocks soared as they returned to normal valuations and higher.
From 2012-2013, Apple dropped by 32%. They were still a growth company at that point. They bought back a mountain of their stock, and did nothing else. Over the next 6 years they went up 350% from that bottom, even as their growth prospects vanished. Sadly, today, now that they've run out of ideas, they've given up 25% again from their top.
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Post by MoBuckChaser on Feb 16, 2019 8:37:40 GMT -6
So how much does a guy expect to spend in retirement? 50% of their current income? 75%? or the same? and for how long. at 75 years old will you spend the same as 65 years old. What happens if you make it to 85 years old? You just sit in the house and do nothing? I hope to be at the bar yet playing grab ass with the old honey's! LOL!
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Post by Bwoods11 on Feb 16, 2019 8:40:36 GMT -6
I definitely like stocks more than bonds!
The dividend plus growth, seems to outperform.
I also like farm land more than gold. Gold doesn’t pay yearly rent.
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Post by MoBuckChaser on Feb 16, 2019 8:46:03 GMT -6
I definitely like stocks more than bonds! The dividend plus growth, seems to outperform. I also like farm land more than gold. Gold doesn’t pay yearly rent. I equate gold to putting your money on red or black at the roulette wheel.
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Post by chummer16 on Feb 16, 2019 9:02:06 GMT -6
I grow more disgusted with the left in this country I am leaning towards winter on an island and summer at my camp where the lefties don’t go. We will need to be 6 months out of NY a year. Financial planner says we need 4 million at retirement to make this plan happen. Not sure if we will make it there but that is the plan as of now. $4 million? That has to be pre-tax no? That seems like a whale of a nest egg. I'd ditch that New York shit entirely if at all possible. Pre-tax. We stopped putting into the Roth because our income level is too high. I didn’t understand that but that is what the planner said. I guess he is assuming we will be at a higher tax rate now then later. We are putting 38k a year in 401k’s and 500 a month into a stock account which we pick a stock every few months to invest in. We should have our first million in assets in about 5 years. That puts me at 48 and my wife at 44. Glaring holes in the plan are 2 kids to put through college and a health care plan for retirement. As for NY, I grew up here and love it, it will be hard to leave but Cuomo is running it into the ground and making the decision easier. My wife makes the real money so the trick will be retiring 5 years before her and keep the cash rolling in.
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Post by MoBuckChaser on Feb 16, 2019 9:06:05 GMT -6
$4 million? That has to be pre-tax no? That seems like a whale of a nest egg. I'd ditch that New York shit entirely if at all possible. Pre-tax. We stopped putting into the Roth because our income level is too high. I didn’t understand that but that is what the planner said. I guess he is assuming we will be at a higher tax rate now then later. We are putting 38k a year in 401k’s and 500 a month into a stock account which we pick a stock every few months to invest in. We should have our first million in assets in about 5 years. That puts me at 48 and my wife at 44. Glaring holes in the plan are 2 kids to put through college and a health care plan for retirement. As for NY, I grew up here and love it, it will be hard to leave but Cuomo is running it into the ground and making the decision easier. My wife makes the real money so the trick will be retiring 5 years before her and keep the cash rolling in. Real trick would be to keep her happy the rest of your life so sugar momma don't jump ship for the pool boy.....
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Post by mnfish on Feb 16, 2019 9:18:17 GMT -6
Not that it matters what i think, but i disagree agree with those numbers. Especially under tax shelters like a Roth. At an average ROR of 9% inside a Roth, 5 million would be $450,000 annual income! Damn man thats a lot of golf Well......MOST financial planners would like you to spend 3 to 4% of your nest egg.....if you want it to last......not the 9% said above. If you spend over 5% your money will not likely last long enough to see you to the grave. NOBODY is spending 9% and having their money last. You may be able to get as much as a 9% ROI in some years....but when your ability to EARN and income is gone in retirement you need to keep at least 40% of your money in bonds to minimize the affects of a prolonged market downturn. So.....if stocks fall to the shitter.....you still have some dry powder to bring to the table to recover....and some level of income to get you through without further depleting your nest-egg. There is also inflation and taxes to consider. THUS.....the 4% equation - which is quiet universal in nature. Therefore if you have 3 million in investments at 4% drawdown.....that is more like $120 k per year before taxes. That does not make for a "lavish" lifestyle. Not squaller either I grant you.....but not lavish. I rest my case. I stand corrected😉
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Post by Sandbur on Feb 16, 2019 9:26:29 GMT -6
So how much does a guy expect to spend in retirement? 50% of their current income? 75%? or the same? and for how long. at 75 years old will you spend the same as 65 years old. What happens if you make it to 85 years old? You just sit in the house and do nothing? I hope to be at the bar yet playing grab ass with the old honey's! LOL! You need a budget for now and for later... and for spoiling the grandkids. Some estimates are 75 or 80% of current income to retire. You will spend less as you age but probably pay the difference in health care.
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Post by benmnwi on Feb 16, 2019 9:33:59 GMT -6
So if I don’t have kids does that mean I don’t need $4-5 million? I havent lived a lavish lifestyle for my 55 years and don’t plan on it during retirement. I did go go to the store on the way to camp last night and picked up a few things for dinner and breakfast. 2 1/2 small plastic bags of stuff and it came to $42. I guess I eat well. If you don't have kids, you have a way better chance getting to your retirement goal early! These damn kids are expensive.
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Post by MoBuckChaser on Feb 16, 2019 10:06:51 GMT -6
Does anyone still dick around with those MLP's anymore? They looked risky as hell to me and the income tax on them in other states I didn't like. so I never got into them.
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Post by Foggy on Feb 16, 2019 10:37:05 GMT -6
I got an MLP which has been one of my best performers. I do hate waiting for them on tax filing. I've made allot of dough off this and my planner likes it in place of bonds to get a return that does not move in lock step with the markets.
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Post by Foggy on Feb 16, 2019 10:48:04 GMT -6
Regarding the bond discussion above. I HATE bonds.......and never had much time for them in the past. But now as I get older I own a Bond Ladder( of relatively short duration bonds). I know it pulls down my ROI.....especially as their has been little interest to be had over the past ten years. I hold all individual bonds and most are tax free muni bonds.
I REALLY hate bond funds. They don't have any maturity for an individual so they will be hard to understand and provide poor results in my opinion. The ONE thing good about bonds is that they are said to be stable and provide relatively risk free storage of dollars while providing a low level of interest (currently).....IF YOU HOLD THEM TO MATURITY! Thus if the market goes way down.....you can re-balance and get a bit more return when the stock market recovers.
I think the same can be said for income producing real estate like farm land (which has been bought at a fair price) as land has proven to me to be a stable place to hold money. It should provide a better rate of return than bonds and has some degree of liquidity - albeit not fast like a bond. So....perhaps a person could make a case to hold 20% in bonds and 20% in good income producing real estate? I always wanted to do that.....but the farm land prices shortly after I sold my biz skyrocketed and there was little ROI in farm land.
Land is still pretty high by past standards......though I am pretty far removed from current ag land affairs. I have some farmer freids down here in OZ.....and they feel they can get from 3 to 5% (5 may be greedy high) ROI on their farm land holdings at current land prices. Dunno. So....land or other building income (rent) could be a good source of non-bond investments. Deer property?.....not so much. Also there are lots of guys that are well trained in markets and quite nimble traders.....whom will outperform the markets. Some guys have a good knack at spotting good values and acting on their wit and instincts. Savy traders, etc. It may be easy to do that with a small portfolio or when you dont need the money on a daily basis.....but that gets lots harder as you are retired or lose interest in day to day watching you're holdings, etc. I did that for a few years....and did quite well.....but it got old real fast as I was spending several hours each day doing this stuff instead of enjoying life. Now I have a professional doing this.....and things are quite stabili.....I suppose I am happy with stability.....although at a lower ROI.
My 2 cents.
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Post by sd51555 on Feb 16, 2019 10:57:33 GMT -6
$4 million? That has to be pre-tax no? That seems like a whale of a nest egg. I'd ditch that New York shit entirely if at all possible. Pre-tax. We stopped putting into the Roth because our income level is too high. I didn’t understand that but that is what the planner said. I guess he is assuming we will be at a higher tax rate now then later. We are putting 38k a year in 401k’s and 500 a month into a stock account which we pick a stock every few months to invest in. We should have our first million in assets in about 5 years. That puts me at 48 and my wife at 44. Glaring holes in the plan are 2 kids to put through college and a health care plan for retirement. As for NY, I grew up here and love it, it will be hard to leave but Cuomo is running it into the ground and making the decision easier. My wife makes the real money so the trick will be retiring 5 years before her and keep the cash rolling in. Do you have any traditional IRA money now, or is it all in 401k? If you have no money in traditional IRAs, I'd seriously consider a backdoor Roth IRA. It's a slick way to scoot right around those Roth income limits. There are more details to mind, but the big one is if you don't have a traditional, you've got a green light for a painless backdoor Roth. Also look at your tax pie. You gotta mind your ratios. What percentage of your retirement assets are: Tax free: Roth IRA, Roth 401k Tax deferred: 401k, traditional IRA, HSA Taxable: Your plain stock account etc. You don't want to be lugging too much tax load into retirement. Once you're too heavy in tax deferred stuff, you have to start discounting it's value, because to get at it, you're gonna have to give a huge chunk to AOC, or be relegated to smaller distributions to keep your tax bracket in line. www.rothira.com/what-is-a-backdoor-roth-ira
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Post by Foggy on Feb 16, 2019 11:04:43 GMT -6
I converted some of our IRA into a Roth....by paying the taxes. It's likely I will die with this Roth money.....and give it to my kids so they continue to get tax free income during their lives. One of the biggest advantages of a Roth. (if my kids have enough assets by the time I croak....I may generation skip and give it to my grandkids....dunno). I now have to take my regular IRA distributions each year.....but we are using that to give to churches or other non-profits so I dont have to pay tax on those IRA income monies. The thing is .....all that scrimping and saving I did ....feels like it all fly's out the window. lol. It doesn't......but it still feels that way. I guess I am fortunate to have such problems......but it still kinda irritates as earlier in life we could have been living it up a bit more.....lol. Hard to have your cake and eat it too. .
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