I would try a variety. Maybe a few Norwegians on your driest humps. Go light on the planting the first year. Give it a year or two and see what works best for your land.
Then you can plant the bulk with what you see works best. Maybe hard to wait and do it like that, but maybe better than going all in the first year and not getting results you want.
I like the idea but waiting is probably a bad idea as Its already going to be tough to fight the natural regen that is going to start after the sun hits the floor. I think that is why I decided on 2/3 black and 1/3 norway back in the day when I started planning this project.
I can't honestly say how they're doing today. I think the deer have hit them hard the past few years and opening the canopy has made it much thicker in there. My guess would be dead via browsing, or swamped by other regen.
With care, I'd go with them all over again for a site like that. Every other spruce I've planted on that property hasn't lived, and if it has, it hasn't done shit. That woods is just too mature (no browse/cover) for unprotected seedlings of any kind.
Not good SD. I thought deer won't really brose Norway and black.
I can't honestly say how they're doing today. I think the deer have hit them hard the past few years and opening the canopy has made it much thicker in there. My guess would be dead via browsing, or swamped by other regen.
With care, I'd go with them all over again for a site like that. Every other spruce I've planted on that property hasn't lived, and if it has, it hasn't done shit. That woods is just too mature (no browse/cover) for unprotected seedlings of any kind.
Not good SD. I thought deer won't really brose Norway and black.
Don't take what happens by me as normal. If I painted the end of a T-post green, the deer would browse it. I would look at your own property first and gauge how heavy your browsing is. I walked another place this past fall that had more deer than me and his RO dogwood wasn't touched, but this guy also actively manages his browse and canopy.
Up on the joint property, there hasn't been a gallon of saw fuel used since we bought it 6 years ago. I just got my new habitat plan ironed out this weekend, so I can start cutting on my new place as soon as I can get back up there.
Black spruce is hard to beat if you are looking for cover in wet areas. Your logger was kind of right and kind of wrong at the same time. Black spruce grow nearly as fast as white spruce if they are planted on the same drier ground. I've pulled out tons of black spruce seedlings from my swamp and transplanted them on dry ground. They grow slow the first few years just like white spruce, then they really take off and can grow 12"-18"+ per year. I have some 8 year old black spruce transplants that are probably 10-12' tall. Their natural shape seems to be generally narrower than other spruce trees though for what it's worth.
The slow growth rate your logger is referring to likely is from black spruce that grow in super saturated soils (mine grow wild with tamarack in a bog that also has wild cranberries). I have wild old black spruce trees in my swamp that only grow an inch or two per year. I have no idea how they even survive since the water table is only inches below the surface, but somehow they survive. they just grow really slow. I've cut some 5" diameter spruce trees down and the growth rings are so tight I'm confident they are 50+ years old.
I've never found any sign of browsing on black spruce on my land in Rusk County WI. The deer numbers are relatively low there though, but even when the numbers were higher several years ago they still left the black spruce alone.
Black spruce is hard to beat if you are looking for cover in wet areas. Your logger was kind of right and kind of wrong at the same time. Black spruce grow nearly as fast as white spruce if they are planted on the same drier ground. I've pulled out tons of black spruce seedlings from my swamp and transplanted them on dry ground. They grow slow the first few years just like white spruce, then they really take off and can grow 12"-18"+ per year. I have some 8 year old black spruce transplants that are probably 10-12' tall. Their natural shape seems to be generally narrower than other spruce trees though for what it's worth.
The slow growth rate your logger is referring to likely is from black spruce that grow in super saturated soils (mine grow wild with tamarack in a bog that also has wild cranberries). I have wild old black spruce trees in my swamp that only grow an inch or two per year. I have no idea how they even survive since the water table is only inches below the surface, but somehow they survive. they just grow really slow. I've cut some 5" diameter spruce trees down and the growth rings are so tight I'm confident they are 50+ years old.
I've never found any sign of browsing on black spruce on my land in Rusk County WI. The deer numbers are relatively low there though, but even when the numbers were higher several years ago they still left the black spruce alone.
How hard is it to put 6A's in the ground with a tool? Wonder if Jim still has some tools that would do that or what have you guys found to do a little bigger tree than 4as?
I haven't read all this however you open to tamarack? In our area they are great cover since the understory is usually tamarack or wetland grasses. Tamarack swamps hold some of our nicest bucks in this area.
How hard is it to put 6A's in the ground with a tool? Wonder if Jim still has some tools that would do that or what have you guys found to do a little bigger tree than 4as?
Post by nhmountains on Dec 12, 2017 5:34:04 GMT -6
Brad,
Is this area going to be logged? If so, if you leave and plant in the tops you'll stand a better chance of survival. Balsam here in NH grow great. They spring up all over the place. Hummock wise I'd try getting some old bales of hay. Put a pile of hay on each mound. Plant inside the hay. As it rots down it'll give those seedlings more nutrients.
Is this area going to be logged? If so, if you leave and plant in the tops you'll stand a better chance of survival. Balsam here in NH grow great. They spring up all over the place. Hummock wise I'd try getting some old bales of hay. Put a pile of hay on each mound. Plant inside the hay. As it rots down it'll give those seedlings more nutrients.